Talking Real Money - Investing Talk
Financial talk radio veteran, Don McDonald and former host of Serious Money on PBS, Tom Cock, join forces to talk about real money issues. In each episode, they solve real money problems, dole out real investing (not speculating) advice, and really explain the financial issues that effect all of us. Plus, it's actually fun! Talking Real Money is a podcast designed to provide the real help we all need to enjoy a really great future. Call in with your questions anytime at 855-935-TALK (8255).
Talking Real Money - Investing Talk
Bond. Very Long Bond.
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
AI’s appetite for data centers is sending tech giants to the bond market—and some of that debt will still be around in 2075. Don and Tom look at the scale of the borrowing and why a tempting yield deserves a closer look.
They separate coupon rate from yield to maturity, explain senior unsecured debt, and show how brutally interest-rate-sensitive a 50-year bond can be. The verdict: these bonds may belong in a broad index, but they don’t belong on your personal shopping list.
Listener questions cover sequence-of-return risk, Roth IRAs versus 529s for children, and the smart savings order for a 19-year-old earning real money for the first time.
Timestamps:
0:38 AI, data centers, and corporate debt
3:40 The $50 trillion U.S. bond market
5:21 Big Tech’s borrowing binge
7:06 Coupon rate versus yield to maturity
8:10 The danger in a 50-year bond
12:45 Sequence-of-return risk in retirement
16:05 Roth IRAs and 529s for children
20:14 A young saver’s order of operations
AI Bond Boom
SPEAKER_04All right, that may be one of my favorites. Um no, I did not go out and find a tavern full of whalers singing a rousing sea shanty. No, that was AI. And it just so happens that AI is our topic today, I. AI bonds. Hi, everybody, I'm Don McDonald over there in the Model Military Aircraft Museum. Tom Cock, back from his brief vacation to Lake Shallan and off on another one. You can't go more than a day or so without a vacation.
SPEAKER_01You got to give me credit for the pivot because uh we're all sitting around in the smoke going, what are we gonna do? What are we gonna do? And I said, What about like just getting on a plane, going to California? Everybody looked at me like I was crazy, because you know I'm not a spontaneous, I'm a planning guy. I've got everything. Yeah, no, this shocks the heck out of me.
SPEAKER_04I don't even know where this came from.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, how much wine did you have? Anyway, so I uh so we all pivoted, and yeah, we're all getting on a plane and going to Southern California, so bye. Good luck. Out of the smoke.
SPEAKER_04All right. I don't know that we'll ever record another another one because he won't want to come back from smoke-free and rain-free and freezing-free California. Exactly. All right, let's talk about AI. One of the things that AI has instigated, has started, has caused to explode is the construction of data centers. It has caused chip prices to go through the roof. The stocks of those companies that make chips have commensurately increased. And a lot of big companies and small, but the big companies have more dough and more ability to get it, are building gigantic multi-billion dollar buildings in which all of these computers will be stored and processed data for Chat GPT and Claude and uh all of that. And uh and Suno, who makes our music. There you go. You know, these all have to they have to have giant computers to make all this stuff happen. I mean, you think about what they're doing. But to do this, it requires a ton of money. And they don't want to dilute their shares by issuing new stock. So what these companies do is they go to the bond market.
SPEAKER_01How big is just before you even go there, how big is the bond market? It's fairly sizable, right?
SPEAKER_04You mean the total bond market?
SPEAKER_01Bond market is fill in the blank. US or let's just go with U.S. because that's easier. I guess I could have looked this up myself. But it struck me when I read the piece, like that's sounds like a lot of money.
SPEAKER_04It's huge. It's no, it's huge. It's gigantic. Uh let's see. Hold on, let me see if I can find the number. Uh let's see. Okay, I gotta get this from the Federal Reserve. So we have a real number.
SPEAKER_01Uh call somebody there live on the show and ask them.
SPEAKER_04Oh, it's big.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Oh, it's big. How big?
SPEAKER_01How big is it? About fifty trillion dollars. Okay. So this is still a small part of that. But the numbers when you hear them, you're gonna scale.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, but corporate I mean, corporate bonds are eleven and a half trillion dollars. Uh U.S. Treasuries, of course, the bulk of it, thirty trillion dollars we owe.
SPEAKER_01Thirty trillion dollars. Are we gonna have to hurry up and pay that before we're gone, or how's that gonna work?
SPEAKER_04No, that ain't happening. Okay. And that's and by the way, this happening before we die, these bonds aren't gonna pay off. Couldn't believe before, Tom. Couldn't believe the maturities, but yeah, a little longer. Instead of floating bonds for, you know, 15, 20, 30 years, I guess they figure their data centers are gonna last longer than that. Hmm. Technology changes, who knows? Anyway, so these big companies like Alphabet and Meta, Amazon, Amazon, and mini others, Microsoft, Spa, okay, there's more. Look at that. They just keep popping up. They're all issuing bonds that instead of maturing in 10 years, or 20, or 30, which tends to be the long-term bond max. That's what the U.S. government long-term bond max is. 30. Yeah. They're going way out there, Tom.
SPEAKER_01They're going to 2075. Isn't that like a big thing?
SPEAKER_04I will definitely be dead by then.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_04I guess I shouldn't buy this bond. Okay.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And it's not, it's not it's an insignificant amount when you consider the size of the bond market, but it's not an insignificant amount when you consider just the number. Um, they've already floated, and by the way, I think this is when you hear about these companies and the capex, right? The spending that's going to all take the capital expense, C A P E X, as they talk about that. They've already floated $250 billion with a B dollars in bonds this year. We'll talk about specifically what these bonds are. And they're they're shooting for another $400 billion uh issued by some estimates by the year 2027. Isn't that like next year? Next year. Yeah, it's pretty soon.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, I can
Bond Yields Explained
SPEAKER_04count that far.
SPEAKER_01And here's the point fascinating. If you if Microsoft wants to go to the market to borrow money in the short term, they're paying what, 2%, 3%? They're not paying much.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, okay, maybe four. Maybe four. Four, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Not much, though. But in this case, because these are tied somehow, which I maybe hopefully you can clarify for me, because when I read, I couldn't find exactly how. I got to do it. These are tied to the construction projects, the actual building of these centers. And so the yields wow, uh, six and a half, seven percent in some cases. I mean, you people are gonna look, I guarantee what they're gonna do. Microsoft's issuing a bond at seven, sold. They'll take it, not even thinking about the fact that you gotta wait 50 years to get your principal back.
SPEAKER_04Well, here's the deal with these bonds. I went and looked up the meta and the alphabet bond. The alphabet bond is more highly rated than the meta bond. It's a double A plus paper. Okay. Okay, this is full faith and credit paper, but not secured. It is not secured by the company's assets, but it is first in line as a debtor. Oh, and by the way, uh corporate triple A plus corporate bonds are actually paying are actually closer to five percent.
SPEAKER_01Ah, okay. I knew rates have gone up a little bit and the bond market has responded about.
SPEAKER_04Roughly about 5.3 percent.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_04All right. Uh the the Alphabet 2075 is the one that's at about six point five yield to maturity.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, now that's a careful number. You gotta pay attention to that.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. A bond, as a matter of fact, this Alphabet 2075 bond that we're talking about has a coupon yield. The interest they pay every year is five point seven five percent.
SPEAKER_01So it's not that dramatic then. It's still more, but not that much.
SPEAKER_04Right. The bond is priced at eighty-some odd cents on the dollar. So that when it matures in twenty seventy-five, your grandkids will you collect that extra one percent per year in interest. Exactly. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So then you gotta wait for a while. Plus, I mean, obviously.
Long Bonds, Big Risks
SPEAKER_01So, okay, but just looking, stepping back, I mean, you know our perspective on fixed income. I we don't want to hold things that are that lengthy. I can get you into a 99-year Argentinian bond if you're okay with that. I mean, that's a long time to wait. Well, why though? Why don't we like long-term bonds? What is it about them that's a good idea? Because something could happen. Think of all the things that could happen here. You already mentioned what technology might change in 50 years, possibly. You think these companies, how many companies are even around after 50 years?
SPEAKER_04Well, let's think about the big technology stocks of the 60s, shall we?
SPEAKER_01I IBM.
SPEAKER_04Uh well, they're still around. Yeah, they're still around Xerox.
SPEAKER_01The copy people or Kodak. Sure. They're still doing something. I don't know what.
SPEAKER_04But they're they all they all got into fact. I'd looked up old Kodak bonds, unsecured, yeah. How much? Full faith. Uh after their bankruptcy in 2012, five cents on the dollar. Yeah. I'm sorry. And here's the other problem with long-term bonds. They're very interest rate sensitive. They're very so. So the longer the bonds in your portfolio, the more dramatic the impact of interest rates on that portfolio. For example, in a 75-year, well, actually, they only know for about 50-year bonds. Nobody's actually done the math on 75 that I could find. But for a for a 50-year bond, which I guess there are some out there, you can expect they will fall by about 15 or more percentage points with one with a 1% increase in interest rates.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, right, of course. Because your bond's worth less. They have to.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, and it may be more like 20 to 25 percent. So it's pretty traumatic.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I and still no one really talks about beyond the companies themselves, beyond the interest rate changes, you're gonna all those other things. Kind of where will AI be in 50 years? I mean, it changes like overnight. 50 years is so long to figure out.
SPEAKER_04AI will have just abrogated all the debt. It will just say, sorry, you guys don't need money anymore. I'm giving you a salary, I've taken over everything.
SPEAKER_01Just be some salary for the fact that you're gonna be able to do it.
SPEAKER_04Please go to the beach and hang out with your family all year, Tom. You'll be happy.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I'll be better off. I so uh so if we were the I guess there's a question. I'm assuming these will be in the total bond portfolio at some point, right? They already are. I mean, the Yeah, that'd be a teeny part of it, but they're in there, yeah. But we would not be recommending you run out and buy these bonds because it's the very lengthy maturity, because the sort of narrowness of them. And frankly, to me, it just it feels like they're backed by the full faith and credit of these companies, but I'm not sure they are. Did you get it? They are. No, they are. Oh no, I looked at the biggest.
SPEAKER_04No, they carry the corporate rating. The the alphabet bonds carry the double A plus rating of Alphabet, the meta bonds carry the double A minus rating of uh Meta, which is and I look them up. They are unsecured, senior unsecured debt.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_04Which means they're full faith and credit of the company. But of the company. That's not like full faith and credit of the U.S. government. No. These companies don't have the ability to raise your taxes to pay their debt.
SPEAKER_01So we're what what what's I mean again, my take is you're taking on risk you don't need to take in fixed income. That's my way.
SPEAKER_04Well, hold on, I was just checking to see if they would be included in the the um Vanguard bond. Yeah, the which is the the aggregate bond and uh index. Yes, yes, they are in there as long as they have a year to maturity. Uh they don't have there's no maximum maturity, so they go in, but they're just tiny. A few hundredths of one percent.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_04These bonds. So it's not gonna kill you.
SPEAKER_01I wish them well, but this is I I wouldn't be racing off to buy them either.
SPEAKER_02So no way. Crazy. Now leave away, boys and middle. A question aboard from a landlocked friend. Tom repeats your questions loud and clear.
Sequence Risk Questions
SPEAKER_04Tom's question time. Here's Tom with questions you sent in at talkingrealmoney.com.
SPEAKER_01In Norwalk, Connecticut, Bill writes us, Hi, Tom and Don. People talk about the impact of sequence of returns at or immediately before retirement. Why isn't it just as much a worry after retirement, especially in the first five years after retirement?
SPEAKER_04It is. It is. It is.
SPEAKER_01I don't sequence of return risk generally.
SPEAKER_04Most people talk about sequence of return risk when you retire.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, because you're going to start pulling the money out. And if the market's going down while you're taking the money out, that's a good thing.
SPEAKER_04Okay, I think what they're saying is before you retire, you need to think about sequence of return risk. Maybe that's what you're referring to. There's a lot of talk about you might want to adjust your portfolio to reduce the sequence of return risk, which means having taking out so much money initially that you really hurt the value of your portfolio going forward in a declining market. Trevor Burrus, Jr.
SPEAKER_01And selling things that have gone down. This is another reason to have fixed income. Assume, for example, you have a million-dollar portfolio, 60% and stocks 40% in bonds. Stock market goes down 20%, as believe it or not, it's going to do that again someday. I don't know when, but it will. Maybe more. 30%. You have all this money in bonds. So you have $400,000 in bonds. If you need to draw $50K a year, you have eight years you could draw those bonds without having to pull anything from stocks.
SPEAKER_04That's one of the big benefits of bonds. When people say, well, why do you want those bonds? That may be one in addition to providing portfolio stability, in other words, allowing the entire portfolio to maybe in a 50% market decline like 2008, reflect a mere 25 or 30% decline. They also provide you that semblance of liquidity that you need to avoid selling the stocks, which is what sequence of return risk is all about.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I also happen to think sequence of return risk is somewhat overrated. People get caught up in what are the first few years are going to look like. Remember, uh, just like life, the retirement is a is more of a, you know, it's a long-term thing. It's not a sprint. It's it's a stroll. You gotta, it's it's a long haul.
SPEAKER_04Like the rest of life, it requires adjusting to circumstances.
SPEAKER_01That's true too, of course. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04All of our lives, it's so funny. All of our lives prior to retirement are spent adjusting to changing circumstances, things we didn't anticipate, surprises that happened along the way, health surprises, relationship surprises, job surprises, price surprises, uh disaster surprises, yeah, like weather surprises, like smoke.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Um all of all of our life we're we're we're dealing with these kinds of changes, and then in retirement, it's like nothing's gonna change. You don't want anything to change? No, you're gonna need to adjust to it. That's why we like to cover all these bases with diversification.
SPEAKER_01Exactly. And by the way, the smoke, the air quality index at Shallan when I departed this morning, 500. And here it's starting to get bad. It's one of the things.
SPEAKER_04I don't really have a reference point for that because I don't know what five hundred means.
SPEAKER_01I came that clearly up smoking. I don't know. Hope not too much higher than 500. Why don't you look that up while I ask another question? Oh, you got another question?
SPEAKER_04Okay.
SPEAKER_01This one comes from nearby Orlando, Florida. I know that place.
Roths and Kids
SPEAKER_01I know you do. Does it make sense to contribute $5,000 for each kid till they turn 18 and then convert these, I'm assuming to an IRA, convert these to Roth when they are in college. I understand you'll pay taxes on it once in the Roth, but it will grow tax-free for the next four or five decades. Okay. First of all, as soon as your child has income, you can put the money in a Roth. You wouldn't need to put it in a traditional IRA. Why would you do that?
SPEAKER_04Why would you want to do that? Yeah, because they don't have enough income to make it worthwhile for the regular anyway.
SPEAKER_01It doesn't make any sense. So in that case, there'd be no conversion. In that case, it's just going to grow tax-free for that child for the rest of their lives. And by the way, they don't have to take it out. I mean, there's a lot of reasons to do a Roth. By the way, if you're going to do something for your child, I still, and I'll make a strong statement for this, think for the most part, the best if you're trying to help them in the future, whether it's through education or retirement, the 529 is the best way to do it. I happen to be driving back today and heard Dave Ramsey, who I struggle with Dave sometimes. Dave was answering a question from somebody, I didn't know he was on Sirius XM. Um, someone called about an Utma versus a 529 Uniform Transfer to Miners Act, Utma, versus the 529 savings plan, which is for college expenses. And Dave said, Well, other than the fact that when the Utma, when the kid gets older, you hand it to them and they're gonna have to pay, you know, tax on that, there's no difference. I thought, and he said it about three times. No, there's a massive difference, a massive difference. By the way, even if you don't think your kid's going to go to college, you can still put the money in a 529 because you can take out $35,000 in total for that child and put it right into their Roth IRA and kickstart their retirement. There is a huge difference between having money in an Utma and a $529. I don't know what I and you know we like Dave, and a lot of you listen to Dave because tell us we like Dave.
SPEAKER_04I like his jet advice.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's what I was saying. With in its general sense, but his investing advice, plus the fact he's talking about.
SPEAKER_04It's like quit talking about the state. He thinks he's the best, but I I'm telling you, almost any fee-only advisor worth his or her salt is gonna say now I I've commissioned advisors love Dave's advice. They love him.
SPEAKER_01He has a lot of them on his payroll. Oh, of course.
SPEAKER_04Not on his payroll, not on his payroll, who advertise. Uh but any fee-only advisor worth his or her salt is gonna say, generally speaking, Dave's financial, I'm sorry, investing advice is subpar. So, but in this really nice subpar.
SPEAKER_01You need, and by the way, we've had this discussion previously. What is income for a child? It could be 1099. It could be, I don't know, there's a lot of other things that get into the gray area, which I don't particularly like. I never did it for my kids until they actually had income from an actual.
SPEAKER_04Technically, you can kind of sort of do it, but you know. Oh, I found out the worst number uh for the EPA's air quality rating.
SPEAKER_01What's a thousand?
SPEAKER_04The best rating you can get, of course, is a zero.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Clear.
SPEAKER_04Zero to fifty means the air's good.
SPEAKER_01Yep.
SPEAKER_04101 to 150 means it's unhealthy for sensitive groups. And you know how sensitive I am, so 201 to 300 means the air is very unhealthy.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_04301 to 500 means it's outright hazardous. Yeah. Which is 500 is the highest number.
SPEAKER_01Oh, that is it. So the the needle is broken at five. The needle snapped pegged in Lake Shallan. Ugh. You couldn't see to the other side of the lake. It was horrible. It looks like it was snowing or something. But anyway, okay. So there's your answer on that one. All right, going moving across to Green Bay, Wisconsin. Go pack. Brady. I'm hoping they play the Broncos this year and can beat you or something. Uh, I just saw the Broncos were like the fourth highest for the Super Bowl this year or something.
SPEAKER_04I saw one power rating that had him at two. Wow, that's crazy. I think it was the New York Times.
SPEAKER_01Apparently they didn't pay much attention to that last game of last season. But okay, um, Brady,
First Job Money Plan
SPEAKER_01thank you for your question. Brady is 19, recently graduated from technical college. Man after your heart here. I started my first full-time job earning a salary in the mid-70,000s, continuing my education through an online bachelor's degree program. Brady, this is awesome. I am fortunate still to be living at home for the next few years, so my living expenses are currently minimal. I want to take advantage of this time to build a strong financial foundation. My goals are to save for retirement, purchase a car, and build savings for future housing and living expenses, trying to determine how I should divide my income among these goals. Would it be recommended to max out my 401k using the Roth option or traditional? Or would I be better off sending up an emergency fund and other investments with the rest of the savings? I'm hoping to save at least half of my take home the next couple of years. That is awesome. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04That's great. What's first? What's first? Maxing the 401k match. What about the emergency fund? No, maxing the 401k match. Up to the match. Up to the match. That's number one. And the free money. Then fund the emergency fund so you don't touch your other stuff. You know, the car's got to sneak in there somewhere unless he can be transportation. Unless he can borrow cars from the folks. And if you can do that, do that. By the way, here's something I would like I would like more of us to start doing. I truly believe, and Tom does not, because Tom's a Luddite. Um I truly believe that the future of transportation in America and around the world is going to be uh some sort of of uh automated transition.
SPEAKER_01I drive a hybrid. No, no, no, no, no. Cars that you don't own. Oh, if somebody else is gonna pile up and pick me up and take me to work?
SPEAKER_04Yep, because think about it. How many hours a day does your car sit in?
SPEAKER_01Oh, a lot. A lot. Yeah. Twenty-three or something.
SPEAKER_04What if that car was constantly in motion? Constantly making, constantly making money, constantly moving people. There's a high degree of efficiency in that.
SPEAKER_01What I would look at if I was young, I feel like we're gonna be rich here.
SPEAKER_04If I was young, I would sit down and do the math. How much is a car going to cost me? How much is the insurance? How much am I going to spend in for my purposes in gas? How much am I going to have to spend on maintenance? Because you're going to buy a used car, it's going to require maintenance. You're not going to buy a new one. Uh they're too expensive. And then calculate all of the places you have to go and how much you would spend going to those places. You can use online calculators to figure this out to do a rough number using Lyft or Uber as your sole means of transportation. They won't come out here anymore. Not to your house. No, you have to serve Did he say he lived on a farm or in a rural area? It's a town. It's a city.
SPEAKER_01Oh, okay. I'm gonna let you call Green Bay a town.
SPEAKER_04All right, wait a minute. Jeez.
SPEAKER_01It's like 200,000 people. It's pretty much. That's a city. Okay. Well, you're the one who called it a town, not me.
SPEAKER_04Well, but you said it was uh I think it's rather bucolic, isn't it?
SPEAKER_01Green Bay.
SPEAKER_04No, it's it's a it's a trust me, it's a city.
SPEAKER_01There's a lot of cows in the outside stuff on there.
SPEAKER_04The the metro area is huge. Because it got okay. The metro area is 350,000 people. Ah, pretty close. That's not huge. You weren't that close. That's a lot. More than Duvall. That doesn't even rank. I mean, come on.
SPEAKER_01We don't have a professional football team either.
SPEAKER_04So more than celebration, but you see, celebration is small, but it is in the greater Orlando Metro, which is like two point something million or something. Anyway, I think we digressed. Look into the cotton skip skip a car. Make a scar, make a car, make a scar. Make a car a low priority. Save up to the match, then start, then get your emergency money there so you're okay, and then uh fund the Roth IRA. There we go.
SPEAKER_01I'm in a lot of pain here, so I'm trying to get rid of the scar. Okay, uh so match, emergency, match, car, and then whatever else.
SPEAKER_04No, match, lift.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I I that's an interesting philosophy. I that's that there's nothing wrong with that, actually, what you just said. If you can figure it out. There's by the way, isn't there a town called like New York where they do that? Nobody owns a car there, right?
SPEAKER_04They just no, it's foolish to own a car there, but I'm just thinking, I mean, honestly, Debbie and I have two cars sitting at our house, and we drive one, maybe a half an hour a day.
SPEAKER_01That's it. Two cars. You should only have one car.
SPEAKER_04Well, the problem is I got the other one to tow the trailer.
SPEAKER_01Which is somewhere in Virginia that nobody knows where it goes. If you've seen Don's trailer, please go to Talking Real Money Doctor. Do you have another question before we run out of time? All right. Lawrenceville,
Tilt Toward Value
SPEAKER_01Georgia, Mike. Gentlemen, thanks for taking the time to answer questions for all of us. I've been thinking about adjusting my Roth IRA to lean more towards value investing. Okay, that's pretty good. My background, my 401k is in VTIVX. VTIVX. VTIVX. Which is I'm sure you could. The only low-cost option available as well.
SPEAKER_04That's the 2045 target.
SPEAKER_01Okay. So that's target date fund 2045, so it's probably 80% in stocks, 20% in bonds. Um covers the entire stock market, but it's cap weighted. That means the bigger companies get more of your money. We prefer to see it the other way around. Everything else in the plan comes with fees of 48 voice basis points are hired. So V T I V X feels like the best choice. For my Roth IR, I'm currently invested in. You're not gonna like this. F-Z-I-L-X.
SPEAKER_04F-Z-I-L-X.
SPEAKER_01I'm gonna have to look up the next one. F-L Cox.
SPEAKER_04F-O-X-L-I-Z-X.
SPEAKER_01F no F-Z-I-L-X.
SPEAKER_04See, I just transpose all those letters. I know.
SPEAKER_01And I'm gonna look up those.
SPEAKER_04Oh, the Fidelity Zero International. That's okay.
SPEAKER_01Ah, okay. F-L-C-O-X must be something similar.
SPEAKER_04It's it's the Tom Cock Fund.
SPEAKER_01Large cap value index. Okay, so I don't know what U R is, but I don't know what UR, Don.
SPEAKER_04I don't know what I are either. It's uh UR Energy.
SPEAKER_01Okay, no, sell that.
SPEAKER_04It's basically a penny stock.
SPEAKER_01It's but he's considering moving all of those choices into A V G V instead. Yeah, cool, great. I think it's great. And then he says, what about having my 401k and Roth invested differently? Does the shifting the Roth IRA to A V G V make sense? Yes. And should I keep a small percentage in UR? No. No, I don't wait.
SPEAKER_04He said, should I keep a small percentage in UR?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, he has UR.
SPEAKER_04He actually asked that question.
SPEAKER_01He did, yes.
SPEAKER_04Oh, you are. Wait a minute. This may be not to be the same thing.
SPEAKER_01Uh G is. You are what? You are.
SPEAKER_04There is no symbol. There is nothing that is UR.
SPEAKER_01Wait, wait, wait, wait. Let me read this again. No, it's UR, it's what he's got here. So all right. I don't know. There is no short answer is no. Get rid of UR, whatever it is. We don't care. Because here's the thing. When you're in VTIVX, which is a globally diversified um target date fund. So it's going to have some bonds and it's multi stocks. It's inexpensive. That's great. But it is, as you said, because it's market cap weighted, it's mainly going to be in growth kind of stocks. So you're going to counterbalance that brilliantly, Mike, by putting money in the A VGV, because now you're going to have sort of a tilt to small and value and some of those other things, factors that the uh the academics trust. So I love that philosophy. And yes, have them in two different funds. Nothing wrong with that at all. Did you find you are or you're not rather scared?
SPEAKER_04I did my research. Can't find it. There is absolutely no U.S. exchange listed security with the symbol UR.
SPEAKER_01We're still trying to figure out what you are.
SPEAKER_04We don't know what you are. You are stumped, as I are, too.
SPEAKER_01We don't know what you are is. We need a jingle for that if you could.
SPEAKER_04That would be you are better off if you are investing in A V G E anyway. So you are in a position where you are probably going to be selling UR if you can sell it because nobody knows what URR.
SPEAKER_01This is painful. Really harsh. Uh thank you for the great questions. Keep them coming. Talkingrealmoney.com. Oh please record some. I'm getting low. Uh-oh. No. Really low.
SPEAKER_04The Friday QA, I mean, could be like two questions next week. If you don't send me some. It could be the smallest Friday QA ever. It could be like three minutes of QA. It's kind of sad. I could just go on about how you are. Or you are not.
SPEAKER_01You aren't?
SPEAKER_04You don't care, do you?
SPEAKER_01I do care, actually.
SPEAKER_04I'm one of the people that does. You know that. You are a nice person, thank you, Tom. Anyway. You are invited to go to talkingrealmoney.com and send in your questions.
SPEAKER_01Gets worse.
SPEAKER_04Record them with the mic button in the lower right corner or just click on ask a question. You know who you are. We still have this bloody respiratory thing going on. Okay. Anyway, uh the other thing we'd like you to do is uh remember that we can help you. We really do like helping people for real. Our advisors, some of them actually enjoy it. Tom definitely does. You just go to talkingroomoney.com and click on the button that says meet an advisor. And you can meet for somebody. Meet for somebody. You are invited to meet with somebody.
SPEAKER_01Maybe that's what he's referring to. The the uh the royal you are. I guess.
SPEAKER_04You are. Yeah. Uh just talk with an advisor who you are. Let us know.
SPEAKER_03And remember, we're talking real money today.
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